Rus News Journal

The Russian political scientists about Putin`s Message

the Head the Press - the newspaper centre “ “ a political observer
N.Andrushchenko:
- Hello, dear colleagues! A subject sew a press - conferences - “ the Message of the President of Russia to Federal Meeting of the Russian Federation, the situation analysis in the country and in the world “. The first word - to Alexander Sergeevichu Tsipko. What have you heard in the today`s Message of the President?

A.Tsipko:
- I have attentively heard to it from beginning to end. Also I will tell my own impression. At first not about the maintenance of speech. I will tell at once, it was pleasant to me, I expected for a long time such speech.
  about any internal dramatic nature. Pay attention, there is any intrigue. I will try to begin with it conversation.
  On the one hand, if to look soberly, soundly, in Russia very seldom there are professional leaders who possess conceptual thinking, political thinking and fine know life of people and to it react.
  here Putin to all of us has shown. If to look conceptually, it is even not Russian speech. I will explain, why. All of us - taki are inclined to metaphysical reasonings on national idea - that he spoke in the end. But here such concrete dot analysis of painful problems - the habitation, roads is, in general, the European, very realistic thinking.
  at Putin -   it is all it is connected: both historical vision, and conceptual, and good savoir vivre. And for me there is such terrible question. Here you have acted with fine thought over program of improvement, upgrade of Russia, revival of Russia. And on the other hand, you leave. Also you frighten us is my last, but not a political testament.
  There is a serious question: what will be with our continuity of the power? You fine understand tradition of Russia. If the president - the new command, the new course, new tastes leaves. Miracles does not happen. Even he the close will appoint the heir - it will strictly never follow its instructions. Because we fine know, who worked in the Kremlin.
  I sat near to Gorbachev on 5 - m a floor and I know structure of the Russian power. You sit there, at you all buttons nuclear - you the owner and at you protection. As soon as you therefrom throw out, another comes - you the private person. Therefore as the private person Putin cannot execute it. Gleb`s these fairy tales and dear Serezhi Markova who listens that it is possible to be in Russia moral authority: as Dan Sjaopin.   Start up it is raised.
  it too mythology. Because Dan Sjaopin was not moral authority, it was the head of staffs of the Chinese national army, therefore supervised the country. What permission?
  probably such. I do not know, to what conclusion Putin but if he says that will be the president has come, probably, will be. How it can, without being the president, to follow such policy?
  only one way - to be the prime minister. I do not see other way. And then he speaks: I do not need a political testament. Because really it is very simple, it is necessary to change nothing in the Constitution.
  However, there there is a distribution of duties - for example, it is necessary to throw KGB, FSB, army, from the president to take away. And then you will be the chancellor.
  then uniform Russia updated, under the direction of Putin goes on elections, conquers, receives (it very easily) more than 50 percent, the government forms. Putin - the operating prime minister. And we receive new model, at which it not the president, and on the other hand, it the person who spends this, in my opinion, the perfect, weighed program of improvement of the Russian life, revival of the Russian nation.
  this my assumption. Perhaps, I am mistaken. But if to think soundly, from the point of view of logic and to read everything that he speaks: I do not give you a political testament, - but, on the other hand, probably, it so.
  I do not see other explanation. We with Alexander Dugin were yesterday on “ a round table “. If to speak from the point of view not Putin`s interests, and from the point of view of interests of Russia, it really should not leave.
  but the first, doubtless - stabilisation of elite has united in one command of liberals and statesmen. At us Sergey Ivans and Dima Medvedev, Chubays`s which friend, and all of them together here sits. But it at it.
  And represent without it? Either that, or that. Means, it unites. Controllability of elite. Zamiril the Chechen Republic. Kadyrov sits. We fine understand - same all lichnostno.
  We fine understand that in Russia stabilisation does not keep on our institutes. By the way, Putin has correctly told. Though this madness should be made with our senate.
  I do not speak, that these places, but at least that represented republics people whom 10 years at least lived there were not on sale. You have paid attention? That is it is necessary to change this election system, formations of our Advice of Federations. And here this problem, a problem of controllability, experience, an elite problem.
  at us, I repeat, institutes are not present, all keeps on the person. By the way, pay attention. I spoke yesterday: here it in Russia the postponed discontent.
  discontent with low pensions, discontent with the destroyed housing and communal services, discontent with humiliation and own poverty. This postponed discontent but only because stability on the person is fastened. You pull out Putin from this stability, and at you at once this postponed discontent turns to the political protest. Or a place for the political protest. Here a great lot of such reasons.

  I do not know Putin, and soul interests - that are not present. It seems to me, is better would be to make on - European. Actively operating prime minister receives new type of legitimacy.
  we do not touch the Constitution. Another matter that the president at us becomes already more representation figure. Here this the first. This my personal impression and reaction to this internal dramatic art.
  And the second why this program, in my opinion, at last is finished and conceptually, and in details? In my opinion, it is connected by that at all points we have left from that outlook - Yeltsin have buried, but has put, probably, not in it. And that outlook on which we built new Russia in the beginning 90 - h.
  Remember these four paradigms. The guarantor of democracy is the West. The guarantor of our security (till now the program of Union of Right Forces) is cooperation with the international nuclear forces, the introduction into the NATO and etc.
  Further. It is the main liberal paradigm. The state leaves economy. Gref still spoke 2 years ago: the main task consists in creating such frame conditions, in which managing subjects,   managing individuals have possibility for business, have possibility to earn.
  look, that Putin speaks, absolutely to it contradicts. The state solves questions of cardinal development, an innovation, creates the state holdings. And it is valid on - it is impossible for another.
  And the third, very important methodological. Within the limits of that concept (truth, Yeltsin too sometimes spoke about culture) the problem of culture, historical memory, spiritual health is a thing functional, derivative. We will solve it, and there will be that. And here absolutely other approach. If there will be no national memory, respect for relics, for the past and etc. then will not be neither economic development, nor the sovereignty. And me it is thought that on all these four points that Putin sounded to us, the Message is an antipode of that such liberal concept of development. And we come to idea of the social policy directed on restoration of the national state. Here that I wanted to tell is very short.

N.Andrushchenko:
- Thanks, Alexander Sergeevich. And now Konstantin Fedorovich Zatulin, the deputy of the State Duma will act known to all people of good will.
  Alexander Sergeevicha has such basic thought after the Message of the President that the president read not a political testament, and the program of the actions for the following term, as the operating prime minister. To you, how to the participant of this event how it seemed, a leah really so?


K.Zatulin:
- All of us were participants of this event because thanks to television all were accomplices zaslushivanija Messages of the President together with deputies of the State Duma, the councillors of Federation who were in a hall, in an air mode. I think that the first impressions of this Message that it very in details in that, as to problems the next five years in socially - economic sphere.
  at least, the president repeatedly resulted figures, repeatedly showed the representation about any problems which exist in social life, in economy. He has devoted unusually a lot of time as you, probably, have noticed, to problems housing - municipal services, to creation of new structures which urged to change quality of our economic growth.   Has concerned such sacred cow as the means saved up or saved up by means of oil and gas incomes, on what they should go in the near future.
  it seemed To me that or it discusses it that the president following it already should substantially these obligations to continue and incur. But argues not only therefore but also because through any time, by that moment when the basic these obligations will be executed, the turn Vladimir Putin will come again.
  I will remind that he last time, at least, said that our Constitution forbids election of the president for the same term more than two terms successively. Here this word “ successively “ means that we still will meet Vladimir Putin, quite probably, as with the candidate for presidents, if not in 2008 - m, in that 2012 when those programs which have been announced today, should show the results already.
  certainly, different parts of the message neravnotsenny from the point of view of a reality and a problematics. It is possible to tell, the president continues own tradition - to speak about details of the foreign policy as less as possible. More recently he has devoted it the developed speech in Munich. I think that those who is interested, can get acquainted with its philosophy of the international relations and with the today`s analysis of the international relations which it has made in Munich.
  probably, he has not considered necessary to aggravate the debatable moments which so it is bright in the Munich speech have sounded. Though all news agencies today and you, journalists, of course, will notice that fact that he directly calls for the moratorium on execution of the contract on conventional armaments and even to an exit from this contract if negotiations with the NATO countries on this question anything do not come to the end in the near future.
  it here starts with that experience which we already have. These negotiations last already very long. Vaska, meanwhile, continues to eat if to mean perfection of structure of security in Europe for the bill, say, such inventions, as ABM placing.   and already using not the NATO format, and mutual relations of the United States with the separate states of the NATO as it has been shown in a case with Czechia and Poland. In general, to the president as it seems to me, it would not be desirable to detail today the questions connected with the international relations, except for relations to security and the contract on conventional armaments in Europe. And, arriving so, it arrives consistently because also its previous messages are not too detailed when business concerns foreign policy. But they are very concrete, when business concerns internal policy. From this it is possible to draw one conclusion - that the best foreign policy of Russia is its internal policy. That is successes of our internal policy it also are our most important argument in foreign policy.
  And further another from this follows. What is the unions of Russia with somebody in the east or in the west will not give Russia to self-trust such what will give internal development of Russia. That is, if want, this original Russian edition of the concept of a support on own forces which in Russia are which should be and which Russia shows the economic advancement. The president, by the way, from it the beginnings, and the first applause which have sounded in speech of the president, concerned that fact that Russia in ten leading economy of the world.


N.Andrushchenko:
- Thanks, Konstantin Fedorovich. Alexander Gelevich, I ask you, your sensations from the message.

A.Dugin:
- In - the first, I think that this message - so happens, not podgadat, but this message which is intoned last year abidings of our president. And it has coincided with B.N.Yeltsin`s death, the first President of the Russian Federation to whom we celebrated yesterday day of memory. I think that these things - strangely enough, in the history often happens, - are absolutely connected. We have now seen, I, at least, have seen, that Putin whom I anticipated which I supported all these years.
  Putin has sounded the Euroasian model of development of Russia, taken not as system of separate isolated, fragmentary answers to calls of time, internal and foreign policy, and as a certain strategic model.
  I have heard from Putin in this message that never from Putin heard bodily. Fragments it is all was - there,   In different performances, in the previous messages, in separate statements. But Putin now, in my opinion, has made very many.
  it is not simple the will - he has underlined it. It actually a course of Russia which Russia will go.
  here I with Alexander Sergeevichem completely agree. It, in my opinion, simply finished politiko - ideological (pay attention) a design. Offered us as uncontested (very important) as the president at us possesses at us now a maximum of legitimacy which, probably, on a broader scale is possible for the democratic governor.
  its course is completely supported by the population. And here on peak of the legitimacy and popularity he speaks: now I as though it collect all - that you to me delegated, my people delegated to me in a historical context, - and I confirm not only in itself, but in the certain aims laid down over self.
  It seems to me, pathos of its last words of that everyone is obliged to work to Russia, everyone is obliged to work on its greatness, shows that Putin puts this ideological model which he has offered us, over itself(himself). Before we knew Putin, as though intuitively vesting it, this or that. And here now we have learnt that Putin on - to the present thinks, is going to do further. Therefore it is represented to me that here it who, Putin.
  Mr. Putin is Putin of this Message, here this present fundamental Message which has incorporated expectations of the overwhelming majority of the people.
  I am absolutely convinced that this Antiyeltsin Message. This Message buries Yeltsin, and eltsinizm in 90 - e years. All.
  here all basic points are that we long, patriots of Russia whom we want great Russia first of all. Let it will be free, let it will be fair, let it will be with human rights, but greatness - first of all.
  greatness, power, force and absence of external control in the face of external, internal, east, western enemies. Here it is told not simply in each word. All Message is that Russia or will be great, or any. That is here it is a question of the sovereignty in the high-grade economic, social, political maintenance.
  Therefore it is represented to me that the pleasure of my dream is not present a limit from this Message. I was the opponent 90 - h, that new Russia categorically was not pleasant to me. To that new Russia, already on - new new Russia which Putin since 2000 began to build, I began to be engaged, built in gradually, it to support.
  I consider that it is the culmination - that has occurred today. The culmination of correctness of our expectations and our support of the president.
  now very important question. In my opinion, today there was very important event. I divide fears of Ampere-second. TSipko concerning the one who it will do. Because Russia does not believe words, believes only to persons, believes clans, believes groups and etc. Here so it turns out.
  but pay attention, I think that Putin has created today to itself a place. Here this place which we, by the way, in our political life did not see for a long time. This place of the person - the idea carrier. Possessing personal harizmatichnostju.
  Possessing the investment of national legitimacy. And actually for the present saving completeness of the power. Before it now there is a problem, in my opinion, not technical preservation of in power and the influence in a society, and on a broader scale precedent creation in our history when us will correct in this or that form - as the spiritual leader of the nation, as the prime minister, as the leader of parliamentary party - the person - idea.
  the person - the idea, which maintenance is visible in this Message. At me today, to tell the truth, has felt greatly relieved, when I have heard words of this Message. I too very much worried about the third term. I considered that only Putin can carry out all it. But it seemed to me that at such conviction that it will not leave the undertaking, that involvement, Putin`s personal personal historical involvement that he speaks and that it intons, it, probably, better, than we, looking from outside, will solve this problem.
  already not a heir problem is already became minor. A problem of how it to carry out. At Putin hands today are untied. It can put the heir of one, can another, can prove to itself in our society any fast.
  fast of the father of the nation, the leader of the nation, the charismatic leader, the teacher and etc. It will be it in essence. He for this purpose will choose what form? In the face of this message and that we know, it was charged before us that it will not neglect everything, it has simply given us obligations that here my ideas for which me supported, they are openly voiced. And now I promise to you that they will be realised. How? Here I will think. And me all the same, as. Will plant one, two, three heirs, becomes the prime minister, does not become anybody, remains the leader - Putin will correct and further. It will correct in any way, and I think that at it hands are absolutely untied. What wants, such and let corrects. I think that people, supporting a course, will support also its technological decision.
  if he considers that it is necessary to make so, means, it will be right. On - to another - it too will be right. Now at us is round what, otherwise, to rally. To us have given idea, and, basically, we have the right to expect that the organisation created purely technologically “ an United Russia “ will be already political tool of this idea.
  I think that here too there is a rhythmics. Because “ an United Russia “ have made on a turn-key basis, as the new house. It is not known, who lives in it, these are simply empty walls, there still wall-paper is not pasted.
  And it seems to me that Putin has told: that building which to you have prepared, this building under this idea. Perhaps, even more cheerfully as - that will arrive. But I think that here resources big are not present the political.
  but sense of its message I see that in Russia there is a new reality. Not the person, the legal governor who heads system of callous official corruption mechanisms as at us usually happens, and is the person - idea, the person - a position, the person - a course, the person - strategy.
  I will tell even a paradoxical thing. If Putin is not the president, it will carry out more adequately and is more live to carry out these things in life, than if it remains the president.

A.Tsipko:
- Alexander Gelevich, is all beautifully, but is absolutely not realistic. If the person of idea does not supervise FSB, army, the Ministry of Internal Affairs, it the private person and is no more.

A.Dugin:
- There are different forms of control.

A.Tsipko:
- Alexander Gelevich, the fairy tale consists in that … Look at real modern Russia. The overwhelming part of the population did not listen to the Message and does not listen. The overwhelming part of the population will not look your news.

N.Andrushchenko:
- But will vote for Putin.

A.Tsipko:
- Yes. Therefore to speak about that, ideologists to us have created a new reality which antologichna and unites people, it is a myth.

N.Andrushchenko:
- And now a word - to Sergey Aleksandrovichu Markovu who is in other city.

S.Markov:
- Hello, dear colleagues. Allow to use modern telecommunications and to voice the position on this question. It seems to me that the Message, certainly, has program character. But, however, it cannot be considered alone.
  The president has fairly told that it is a certain conceptual plan for development of the country, and it is together with all other last Messages. And all of them practically are guided not the next year, and for long enough period of time - is possible, till 10 years.
  and the president concerning 2008 has accurately responded that there will be a new president, but it does not leave a policy, it will be one of guarantors of performance of realisation of this conceptual plan for development of the country whom, by the way, I think, was developed together with Vladimir Putin, with the future president and with the future of premieres - the minister. And with participation, including speakers of parliament.
  this liderskaja group of politicians will realise this conceptual plan. Though after 2008 Vladimir Putin on - former has not opened the place. Has told only that he will play an important political role. It is the first question which was important everything, - a problem of 2008.
  The second question important is, of course, economic, social development. We, as a matter of fact, see accumulation of tens billions dollars on an abacus at Kudrin with which it pushed out American   securities. As a matter of fact, transition to the active industrial policy. About what the Russian public of the president in the last called some years.
  and we see that large investments will be in economy upgrade. And thereupon the president if he in the first years spoke about stability, about an order, first of all, then the problem has been reached, he has started to speak about growth.
  also there was serious enough criticism from a society that growth is insufficiently, it is necessary to pass to qualitative development. And we saw that words “ development “ “ strategy “ became key in this Message.
  and this basic as though a direction of such development. People spoke: That you, it is not necessary to save ten billions, it is necessary to put in a construction of roads, the airports, planes, steamships and in development of high technologies. Now such plan is presented.
  the following direction is a foreign policy. Here, of course, sensation is the moratorium on DOVSE (the Contract on restriction of arms of usual type). It, of course, not race of arms, and to the contrary, this invitation again to return to razoruzhencheskoj to a problematics.
  Vladimir Putin Rossija`s mouth has told: “ Colleagues, we strictly adhere to all arrangements on disarmament which are accepted for a long time. And what other them do not adhere? Give - ka we will sit down for a negotiating table. It is not necessary for us to continue race of arms “.
  Here again, of course, at Russia very serious allies will be, it is necessary only with them normally to work, not to frighten them. But Europe is too very strongly anxious by that Americans impose race of arms. At all Americans - race of arms, - and those neoconservatives who usurped the power in the modern United States of America too is not necessary to the American people.
  and I believe that the American people on the following presidential election will throw out these neoconservatives from the White house, and Americans too will approach with this our position and will return again on a disarmament platform.
  for me it was personally important about the CIS. That the president began to speak for the first time about the offer of joint programs of development and connection of the CIS countries and to transport corridors of type of the channel Volga - Don, and to the Russian corporations nano - technologies created. It seems to me, it is the first step. Now following steps are necessary. And it is necessary to connect the CIS countries to other projects of joint development - and to projects of incorporated aviation corporation, incorporated ship-building corporation and etc.

N.Andrushchenko:
- Sergey Aleksandrovich, at me only one question. How it seems to you, on your sensations, it was speech of the president which leaves, or it is all - taki the program of the person on the further actions?
S.Markov:
is a program of group of people which will continue to realise this policy. Better to say, it in any measure in common developed, I think, both Putin, and Ivanov, both Medvedev, and adjoined them Mironov with Gryzlov.

N.Andrushchenko:
- There is such opinion, at least, at Alexander Sergeevicha Tsipko it has sounded that if to pull out from this component of one person - Putin Ivanov with Medvedev hardly will make friends.

S.Markov:
- I think that they will not make friends. Because Putin will not be pulled out. He has told that does not leave anywhere. And if someone thinks that Vladimir Putin will pat someone shoulder and will tell: Children, it the most good, I give it all - the power, popularity and etc. he is mistaken. Putin`s popularity remains with it. And people will know, when will come, vote, for what policy they will vote.

N.Andrushchenko:
- you also consider, what Putin does not leave anywhere?

S.Markov:
- It does not leave. But I should add criticism of the president. We analysts, instead of propagandists. When the president told correct words about spirituality, morals, I think that if he has added words that bears a responsibility share for this our television here an applause in a hall would be the loudest.

N.Andrushchenko:
- Thanks, Sergey Aleksandrovich, for participation.

K.Zatulin:
- I wanted to tell that I unique here the deputy. I wish all who participates in this a press - conferences from both parties of this table if they want that, to appear in this skin deputy. But as I the deputy and the legislative citizen should notice that conversations that Putin does not leave anywhere, you, hope, correctly understand, after its performance which once again have confirmed that he does not intend to change the Constitution, to initiate such changes. And after all this sort of conversations are conducted, and conducted at the highest level - at level of that presidium which was today at joint session of chambers.
  you know that Sergey Mironov on this subject periodically starts talking, periodically our society agitates these ideas. But Putin while does not support these ideas, so from the formal point of view Putin will leave in 2008 from fast of the President of the Russian Federation. And we only discuss in what form it, nevertheless, will not be gone from our life. Here again I am not convinced that it will necessarily select for itself(himself) a role of the prime minister.
  because the role of prime minister Putin at the president X, Y or Z is a discredit of fast of the president. Not only the politician, but also the most this post. And I personally think that Putin is enough still the young man to apply for this post through term as it, in general, assumes perusal of our Constitution (does not exclude at least). Another matter that it can influence, it can be on - to a miscellaneous is formalized or not formalized.
  Alexander Sergeevich has told that without FSB and keys from the Ministry of Internal Affairs no politician in Russia has any influence. Should notice that yesterday all - taki have buried Boris Yeltsin who in a current at least had no last 8 years in the hands of direct control over FSB or the Ministry of Internal Affairs and, nevertheless, less, made certain impact.

- Konstantin Fedorovich, is different formulations. Influenced as the person before whom Putin was responsible, and and the president has told, pay attention: I will not be at the power, but I will promote the decision of cardinal problems of Russia.

K.Zatulin:
- I Want to notice that at Putin much more the bases, than at Yeltsin to be assured that it can influence after will leave from fast of the president. First of all, it has generated ruling group. It for today is internally uniform. In it there is no disorder and split as it was in 99 - m to year when was two wings of imperious elite. One has been conditionally presented on a political scene “ Unity “ another was as is conditionally presented “ Fatherland - all Russia “. Not to mention other, smaller groups. And at the moment it is the solid command. It is possible to find, of course, in activity defects, they, certainly, are.
In the today`s message there are things which have not sounded or have sounded not at the full capacity. Well, for example, Sergey Markov has seen that the president, the developed program of an industrial policy has told. I only have had time to look fragments of this program. But I have not seen while, unfortunately, the program of an industrial policy - that which is necessary for Russia davnym - for a long time. And I think that it is connected not with Putin, and with quality of that advice which are given by the economic block of the government. And who gives this advice, all of us know. At me, for example, very serious doubts that it will be possible to realise all these problems hands of this governmental wing. Because   internally this part of the government extremely opposes to this approach, concentrating exclusively on the fiscal purposes and on macroeconomic stabilisation, struggle against inflation and etc.
the Second part as personally it seemed to me, should sound more loudly, in the international section, there, where he spoke about foreign policy problems. It seems to me, for a long time has ripened for Russia which is not tired to declare that the near abroad or new abroad is for it sphere of soul interests, it is necessary the developed positive initiative. These positive initiatives we do not see, unfortunately. And If Poland has guessed together with Ukraine to make an application on UEFA and has won, on political, instead of to the football reasons how you understand why us not to guess to submit any demand together with Ukraine, Belarus, Kazakhstan on the place in the world? We did such demands in 2004. Why we have stopped to be engaged in it? Why at us hands have fallen? That`s it while there is a struggle for positioning of Ukraine, for the future of Kazakhstan, for destiny Russian - the Belarus project, here it would be necessary to tell about necessity of support of these efforts, the second breath of uniform economic space and etc. It is not told. But it is claims, in my opinion, not so much to Putin, how much to those people who prepare these messages. If they do not feel it and do not see, it is a pity.

A.Tsipko:
- I Am possible I will tell concerning your model very shortly? Because conversation very serious, and it basic. I will finish conversation the arguments, why I against this beautiful model. Yes, the command is. But it is real, from the point of view of Russian psychology this model of a diarchy - the most dangerous that is in Russia. One ostensibly the power - the leader of group of people not at the power it is formal, but the moral leader, under your concept, and another - the real power, with phones, with an exit on the world and etc.
  Here I have president, ostensibly the sovereign owner, and on the other hand, I have other, moral leader. In my opinion, misters, it is a nonsense. I very much am afraid of it. It is very beautiful. And if Putin has believed in it, I do not believe that it was the worker of KGB. I do not love utopias. It is my country, and to produce this model of a diarchy I will not allow.
  that Alexander Evgenevich, at me has sounded such sensation that it not your model, and model of people which work on one of heirs. Do not forget, we live in a political situation when there were formulated heirs, they have already staffs. And these models which work already on the future president squeeze into our public consciousness. Though all fine understand - there will be no moral authority, the main thing that we has come to the power. Here of that really I am afraid if to speak seriously.

A.Dugin:
- you reproach me, Alexander Sergeevich, that I work on someone. I wanted to underline that in Russian history there is an example of a skilful diarchy. It constantly is reproduced.
we will remember Ivan the Terrible removal in the Aleksandrovsky large village, the basis oprichniny. Ivan the Terrible has called into question the legitimacy. He has told: - I the legal tsar, I also the legitimate tsar; Now I will spit you and I will leave in the Aleksandrovsky large village. Has turned and has left. All have sat a little bit, have gone to it.
Putin tests actually our relation to legitimacy. He wants to show that in Russia can be not only legal, but also the legitimate governor.

N.Andrushchenko:
- Misters, let`s pass to questions.

the Newspaper “ the Popular initiative “:
- the First question. How you think, why the president, acting with the program on which 8 or 15 years are necessary, discloses it one year prior to the termination of the powers?
and the second question. I, as the person who was in the Kremlin during announcement, know that all lobby, said that occurs today in Tallinn. Why in the presidential message where it was really possible to show, what the Russian power is interested in something an event outside of the Garden ring, has not been told words though all who there was present, spoke about it?

N.Andrushchenko:
- I think that all participants have already answered the first your question. And on the second question, please, Konstantin Fedorovich.

K.Zatulin:
- I think, that occurs in Tallinn, it is a scandalous thing. Russia is obliged to react means available for it. But it not a war cause. But all another can be considered.
I think that the President of the Russian Federation all - taki the person who in the message considers large problems of life of Russia, and not only, but also the whole world. And to react to it situationally that the new episode to that Antirussian course which spends the government of Estonia and some other   was this morning added; the Baltic states. It means simply to liquidate or is artificial to reduce a distance which separates the President of Russia from the president of Estonia or, let us assume, any state or the politician of this country. It means, from the Olympus to fall to these squabbles. It seems to me that the president can make separate performances with this subject if he wants.
Not only in Tallinn something has occurred for these days. As you know, yesterday in Ukraine president Yushchenko has once again entered the same river, having cancelled the decree and having signed, but only with other date. Too, apparently, it is possible to reproach: and why president Putin has told nothing about it, and on a broader scale what its relation to all event?
  give   we will not demand from the presidential message too many. It is a specific kind of the literature which does not provide topic of the day. It provides prospect. To tell the truth, at all gravity of that there is in Tallinn, maybe, I for someone here I will tell blasphemous words, but not relations of Russia with Estonia define the future of the Russian Federation. Here it at least I should tell.

TV “the Star “:
- About Tallinn. Your opinion what consequences can be?

K.Zatulin:
- I already answered today this question. I think that, in - the first, it is an occasion to Russia to be converted into different instances that, as a matter of fact, never superfluous would be and to make before. Including in the European instances.
I think that it is an occasion to Russia to develop wide propagation of the position against actions of Estonia, including with use of the European public. I not without reason speak about Europe because it is essential to Estonia - it a member of the European union and the NATO. But it does not mean that Russia should do nothing itself, be subcontracted to community reaction. Russia should once again proinventarizirovat the possibilities - diplomatic, political, propaganda and economic.
I think that it is that occasion when the Russian Federation will have the right to suspend diplomatic relations, to withdraw the ambassador for any period that in practice of the international relations is strong means. Leah means it, what the model of the CIS completely has got rid of itself? What the main thing in this Message of the President?

K.Zatulin:
- Give, we will divide questions that it was fair. Justice too quite Russian line, should be shown from time to time. As to the CIS, I have already told that me not quite arranges in this part of the presidential message. I think that in spite of the fact that it has the subordinated character, basically, before questions of internal development: social and economic, before necessity of ideological judgement of our future way, for the Message of the President, nevertheless, it could be more sated. And in this case, first of all, I consider, it would be necessary to speak about our vision of the space nearest to us which unites the CIS. There is no sense as it seems to me, the president to detail the relation to the organisation of the CIS, once again to repeat all that has been already repeatedly told - about its worthiness, the lacks, different stages of development. He spoke about it, by the way, last time if you have noticed.
it was meaningful to speak about how we are going to run business with the nearest neighbours slightly more in detail. If you so attentively analyzed other parts of its Message and searched there for any mentions of the CIS countries, it not a unique place where were mentioned a problematics of the CIS.
in - the first, you have perfectly begun with a word “ Russian “. And it is very essential. Because if that at us did not suffice and continues not to suffice, this conformity of our declarations to real affairs when business concerns struggle for preservation of an area of distribution of Russian, support of our compatriots and so on. The second. If to pass to details. He spoke, for example, about transport corridors and necessity of reconstruction of Volgo - Don, and spoke about interest in it of the near-Caspian states. You why - that have missed this moment, when spoke about nano - technologies.
it has shown on concrete examples that it is ready to involve and consider interest of the CIS countries, this or that group, in the general projects with Russia. But it is valid in the compressed concentrated form of the program, concerning development and integration, the word integration has sounded, and the president insisted on it, but in the concrete form here this offer has not been developed.
I think that the president shows care from - that results of building Russian - the Belarus state are not up to the end obvious. He has told about it, but this neochevidnost affects integration general plans. Struggle in Ukraine is not finished. Moreover, it becomes aggravated. That is, maybe, any other president during this moment would insist on the vision. It has left this subject.
further, at us good relations with Kazakhstan, the president has underlined that it will support Nazarbayev for a role of the following head of OSCE. But he did not speak about relations with Kazakhstan as with that. You know, actually with all that support which we have decided to render to Nazarbayev, problems in Russian - the Kazakhstan cooperation exist. Kazakhstan naturally, becomes more and more independent. And being independent, it is no means always ready to co-ordinate with us the priorities and the interests. And it, by the way, is already noticed in the world. And for us on prospect very important: Kazakhstan remains Kazakhstan or it will turn to something similar to Ukraine, only in the east, with the ambiguity when business concerns relations with Russia. Therefore the president also had bases for care. I simply think that the initiative should defeat this care. It is personally my point of view that it is necessary to insist on the. How it is done by Americans. They after all at all do not pay attention, want to enter in Ukraine the NATO or not. They pass the law on support of pressing forward of Ukraine in the NATO. Why to us not to pass the law on support of pressing forward of Ukraine in uniform economic space? Who to us disturbs?

A.Tsipko:
- I think, Putin has arrived very reasonably and wisely that in this difficult situation has not mentioned a problem of Ukraine. Experience shows: the we interfere more actively, without thinking over results, the worse for us.
I with you absolutely not agree that it is business - the plan. You look, it is philosophy, here Dugin of the rights. This absolute negation of that philosophy which we lived in 90 - e years. There there was an economic determinism. We will create a market mechanism, there will be a manufacturer, the culture, spirituality and so on will go. Here all antithetically.
pay attention to a phrase “ a hand control “. National projects and on a broader scale a state policy in the field of investments and so on in agriculture does not pass. Here absolutely social vision, understanding. He speaks: national memory, spirituality, knowledge of history, library, a family, culture. And he absolutely precisely says that really source of development, he has told even “ a sovereignty source “ these spiritual factors in which we were not engaged 15 years are.
Putin has an internal development. Look at the first message, in many respects it the liberal. Correctly Konstantin Fedorovich spoke, in many respects under the influence of liberally conceiving people. But its private experience has shown what really to save a healthy society, libraries, culture and so on it is impossible without the state influence and the state support. It is revolution.

N.Andrushchenko:
- you have paid attention, … as presidential is called, as in the United States.

A.Tsipko:
- Yes. It is revolution. Upasi god, it not business - the plan. It is the concept of changes, the development concept. By the way, it is, of course, more adequate to Russia, the Russian person with its reaction to problems spiritual, cultural, world outlook. But it is adequate on a broader scale to construction of bases of a normal society. It is very good, it is break, in my opinion, Putin`s own outlook if to speak seriously.

K.Zatulin:
- Ideas Putin has started to change, but people changes not always quickly, as ideas.

N.Andrushchenko:
- two More questions.

“ the Popular initiative “:
- Last 15 years have shown that the liberal thesis “ the Market will settle all “ not quite works in Russia. And the largest business - corporations do not work on interests of the state. And the today`s Message of the President has suddenly reminded us such words as “ forward planning “ “ long-term planning “ and “ the state development of a national economy “. What role of the state in macroeconomic?

A.Tsipko:
- We have responded. And I will very shortly tell. In that is continually that in one really market European country, especially type of Germany and France, the state did not refuse all functions of maintenance of manufacture, macroeconomic projects.
remember at least history with “ Ejrbasom “ which Chirac was engaged.
the problem consists that we considered normal that was abnormal. That is our situation of the beginning 90 - h when the state left economy. And the most terrible - the state has declined all responsibility for life of people, for a spiritual status. You all have told.

K.Zatulin:
- your Message was not absolutely exact. It not simply feature of Russia, is universal law. Another matter that at us tried to deny this law and said that the market all will take out also all will create itself. And it is wrong.

N.Andrushchenko:
- Last question.

Moskominform:
- you have correctly noticed that the message basically has been addressed in the country. But we are object of the critical analysis from the West. A leah will add this message to us friends and opponents?

K.Zatulin:
- On the one hand, the president diligently bypassed corners. For example, it in the message at all did not discuss such subjects as the general status Russian - the American relations, has indirectly mentioned a question on ABM placing. Though it is known that this question divides us, instead of unites. He did not tell anything about a distribution and non-distribution problem in connection with the Iranian nuclear file - too one of sharp international problems. In general, he did not aspire to discuss in more details in the speech the international problematics.
on the other hand, we have here this statement under the contract on conventional armaments in Europe. I know that it is a lot of years we have fruitless conversation that it is necessary to ratify this document, but all it only at level of conversations. And in the course of all these arrangements if you have noticed, we have gone, in my opinion, on an erroneous step on a conclusion of our military bases from territory of Georgia. It has not brought absolutely any result. And it was clearly from the very beginning. Our concessions at all do not lead to an immediate recognition from the West.
I think that will be estimated both restraint of president Putin, and its specific proposals which contracts on conventional armaments concern. All the rest was in the general key. Desire, at last, to normalise relations with the European union, to sign that contract which has appeared, it is blocked from - for positions of Poland and other countries. I think that these moments prozvuchaLeah in speech, and it quite, according to the president, is enough. But that you ask this question, means that all - taki we should bolshee pay attention to the international relations from the point of view of an explanation of our position and our plans.
my personal impression of Putin: he very careful person in foreign policy, is engaged in it much, but it as the native of certain structures, is not inclined to announce the actions very often. He, maybe, considers that for someone is warned - means, has already prepared for counteraction. Perhaps, at it such experience in this plan. I personally consider that we should more impulses about the relation to this or that send to the world. That our friends, including, the most important our friends, not only army and fleet, but also all population of the Russian Federation, knew, that we want in a world policy.

A.Tsipko:
- I will very shortly respond. In my opinion, they pragmatists. In a present situation they without us cannot solve any fundamental problem. The North Korea, Iran. However, at them possibility has more. To me it is thought that their Putin`s such worthy foreign policy, of course, irritates, but they get used to it. Eventually, it on - European. If you strong, you with worthiness - mean, you respect.
it seems to me that Putin owing to any amazing keenness, very European person, it precisely feels limits of that they will accept. It seems to me, while it works in these limits - works successfully. They gradually get used to it, conceive and do not try to throw out it from the circle of partners. Contradicting tearing away calling sharply meanwhile is not present anything. If they have swallowed Munich, I think, especially they will swallow it.

N.Andrushchenko:
- Thanks visitors that were at us.