KirienkoKirienko is ready to shifts in the government
From now on the White house starts to count days and hours. The State Duma starts consideration of a package of the laws prepared by the government as legislative support of the anti-recessionary program. The package failure will mean the largest political defeat of the government and the most cruel after 1993 the conflict between power branches. In interview of premieres - minister SERGEY KIRIENKO has expressed readiness to do the utmost for compromise achievement.
- whether there Will be a devaluation? Now at the Chicago stock exchange future contracts for December consist under the rate 8,22 roubles for dollar. Besides, Zadornov`s which are not excluding devaluation last statement, forces to return to this theme.
- you know, I do not want to participate in discussion in the set tonality. Everything that you tell, it from the category of corresponding expectations. Fears, certainly, are. But no plans at the government about it are present. All versions that someone, with someone, at any meetings, confidentially or unclassified, officially or informally discuss it, is a provocation. On ignorance or on intention is already the second question. Who? Why? “ If in the sky light stars, means, it is necessary for somebody “. If it is necessary for somebody, then it is clear. There is enough big list of persons to which devaluation is represented interesting. On it it is possible to earn not bad.
- you mean exporters?
is can be and the exporter. Someone on it can earn. The economy on it as a whole loses. Therefore there is a government plan of action. We are going to adhere to those parametres of a monetary policy which are co-ordinated with the Central bank. Besides, here speech and about a citing manner. From Zadornov`s yesterday`s comment will pull out only a slice with certain turn of a tonality. And Zadornov actually, answering a question - I have once again looked at the shorthand report, - be simple can unduly emotionally tried to say the following thing: if to do nothing, all will be bad. It is obviously perfect. If to do nothing if not to balance incomes and expenses, if not to change tax base, if, if, if... If to do nothing, it will be bad. Then it is possible to say that there will be a collapse of political system, it is possible to say that there will be a disorder of the uniform state, it is possible to say that there will be a falling of national currency and so on. It is possible to result the big list...
- whether there is at you a spare variant in case till August, 1st it will not be possible to co-ordinate with IMF of a condition of granting of new credits?
- always there are some variants. I simply do not consider it necessary to discuss them. You understand, today intensity and an agiotage are so high, what even the careless word can seriously worsen all. I will tell that we have spare variant, the scenarios, different methods of influence on the market, different methods of reaction to different situations. We as it name, the anti-recessionary program comprises also instant reaction to crisis, and the positions which are laying the foundation for stabilisation. Its indispensable condition is acceptance of a package of the bills directed by us in the Duma.
However it is not necessary to narrow all program to level of already discussed bills. It not so. They are only legislative maintenance. And the program is all - taki the document which was considered at the expanded session of the government. It is much wider.
- and on what your confidence is based, what will be possible to adjust dialogue with the Duma? After all if it ruins your bills, it destabilises negotiations from IMF. You could go in the face of such threat on any compromises concerning personnel structure of the office?
- such conversations after all are conducted. Not less, than about devaluation. Probably, it is an admissible limit of the compromise because today it is essentially more important - taki to meet all crisis. Threat is too high.
- let really speak that threat for a financial system and consequently, in general for state security it is high. Therefore compromises here are possible, quite possible. But not trade: That here this law in exchange for this portfolio in the government. Such variant - that is painfully primitive. We need understanding of that for realisation of this program not enough its one acceptance, is necessary the public consent, concentration is necessary. Time now another: such powerful external challenge is thrown down to us that it creates absolutely other internal situation. Very different from that that was at discussion of the program and office formation in April. It objectively so. Then it was possible to dare to defend more rigidly as though cleanliness of interests or there certain economic views in the country. For today consolidation is much more important, and for the sake of it it is possible to renounce any defined, we will tell so, internal approaches.
if this consolidation is looked through including in the decision of any personnel questions then it is quite comprehensible and discussed. As acceptance of the similar program and a reality of a situation both in foreign markets, and on internal in any measure displaces accents in government activity. That we were going to do slowly, today it is necessary to do much faster. Basically, such rate of work and such displacement of accents in certain cases demand other personnel approach.
- the Duma already has had time to express partially under your offers. Anybody, seemingly, two hands to vote for them does not gather. In particular, the big claims to changes in the law on surtax...
- first of all, our package is an offer to negotiations and to meaningful dialogue. If the law is accepted in the first reading we have 10 days structurally to look through its filling. We will tell, all equally understand what to expand base of the taxation on surtax it is necessary. There is a large quantity of incomes of citizens, today not taxable in general. The question begins what to grasp, what not to grasp, what rates, in what volume, what scale. It is reasonable conversation, absolutely concrete, normal offers. Reasonable and good.
or, for example, the surtax rate. We have brought 20 %, but on mood of deputies of the State Duma probability of passage of the bill with the uniform rate of 20 % ischezajushche is small. But all agree what to expand base of surtax and to simplify system of calculations it is necessary. But here it is necessary to understand, from what we proceeded, bringing in advance impassable law. There was an offer which on the government was considered that it is necessary to recede and try in this bill it to write thus as, in our opinion, will be less correct, but more passable.
And all - taki we at entering of bills have stopped that the government bears responsibility for working out of this bill, therefore to bring we owe that bill which coincides with our understanding of a situation. We consider that the flat rate of 20 % would be more correct because attempts to deduce on the rate of 35 % all the same lead to total evasion from taxes. We physically equally do not collect all of them. Then, more real rate would allow to legalise a considerable quantity of taxes and to make inefficient ways of leaving from them. It is clear that it will be corrected by the State Duma. Well, it is a subject of the compromise which we will admit.
- attack to large defaulters - " has been some time ago undertaken; Gazprom “ and other. And now you declare that count first of all on physical persons. Whether means it, what your attack has choked?
- there are enough strict measures concerning the enterprises will proceed, though, naturally, the problem of payment of taxes from large tax bearers is. With them I display a problem on two parts. A part the first are fiscal measures, they should be applied, and anybody will not recede from them. Boris Fedorov of the rights when says that any individual agreements with tax bearers cannot be, it quite right. And actions should be the general.
other party of truth consists that at the present prices for energy carriers on foreign markets many taxes put in the current legislation, to pay is simply unreal. At us already some times occurred so that the taxes put in barrel of oil, more than the price of this barrel. Therefore it is necessary and to operate proceeding from two components. A component the first: fiscal actions should be, diligent payment of taxes should be. The second: it is necessary to understand degree of a reality of it. Our problem - not to turn out economy, not to squeeze out it dry. After all if to squeeze out last juice, the profitable base will be compressed only, and any fiscal measures with it we will not keep up. We will squeeze out more and more - it will be compressed even more. But, I will repeat, fiscal actions will proceed, and we anywhere from them will not get to. This decision is accepted and, for example, access to an export pipe to the oil companies which have not closed the debts before the budget will be limited from now on. It is necessary to do it. The state should demand rigidly execution of laws while they are. We can understand together that they are imperfect that they are bad, but to demand their execution.
- and bankruptcies will proceed?
- certainly. This week competition on carrying out, on the organisation of the auctions on sale of the arrested debt receivable should be declared. Then, claims are submitted on bankruptcy - as in May decisions VCHK made, and all the turn goes. .
- it is a lot of claims?
- as it was supposed, four claims it is submitted. Next week there should be a first consideration in court. It is clear that this process should not generate any illusions about the prompt and general financial well-being. Let`s soberly speak. All - taki bankruptcy procedure even in the accelerated mode occupies half a year. Objectively so. Therefore in this case we cannot enter into a zone of a legal lawlessness of the state. The state is obliged to set an example observance of rules. Because all - taki at bankruptcies is also other creditors, except the state, - it is necessary to give the chance for them to protect the interests when due hereunder. Therefore I do not count on bankruptcies as on a measure which is filling up the budget literally, that is from property sale. But this measure fills up the budget indirectly - as the influence tool.
- you have told once that all it will lead to property repartition...
- End in itself is not only repartition, end in itself is to enhance the responsibility the proprietor. We should show to the proprietor that the state in hands has a tool which allows to force to pay it the property for poor control and for non-payment of taxes in the budget.
- and how you now will characterise a course of negotiations with the International currency fund about the big credit? Will give it or not?
- the Course of negotiations normal. The forecast good. There is a normal work. There is a coordination of positions. The general principles of understanding of a situation and possible actions in many respects coincide.
- and if will give, when?
- Ungrateful this business - forecasts. Before arrival of mission Chubays gave conservative forecasts that it occupies month - two. And the first round of negotiations within several days has shown that we find understanding points much faster. The program question was the main thing. Each time at similar loans is developed a certain program. For us that the IMF perceives that program which we have already developed was essentially important. We cannot have two programs. We have an anti-recessionary program, and we recognise that it and there is that program which considers IMF as a condition of granting of credits. Here the points of view as a whole have coincided. That set of measures as which we considered essentially important for ourselves, in many respects coincides with basic understanding of IMF. Therefore we had a sensation that we can pass terms of negotiations much faster. It can be measured not months, and weeks. These negotiations within July will come to the end, I think. More precisely to speak, when they will come to the end, simply indecently.